Tried It -- It Didn't Work
Sorry, I haven't had much time for blogging lately. But I had an interesting experience yesterday.
I was in my hotel room in Hefei, which is a small city of about a million people in Anhui Province, China. I was watching TV, which in China is just a hoot. Naturally you can't tell what they're saying, but they have these surrealistic stories, and you are constantly reminded that you are not in Kansas any more. It is really entertaining, sometimes it's old-times princes and princesses or evil warlords, or wacky contemporary love stories with ... crazy stuff. People fly, furniture talks, crazy fun magical stuff. Also, there's Chinese MTV and other more familiar programming.
Anyway, I was clicking the remote and I came across the news in English. It was read by a Chinese anchor and had Chinese reporters, but it was in English. This was the only time I've seen this here, though I admit I haven't watched a whole lot of television while I've been in this country.
So I sat here in China watching the President of the United States sign a bill allowing unlimited detention, without legal representation, of noncitizens, even those living in the United States, among other things. They can be put to death without being able to defend themselves. The Chinese lady read her script in near-perfect English, noting that some people considered the bill controversial.
He had a little banner hanging over his podium that said "Protecting America," as I recall.
Pretty soon it switched back to Mandarin, and I clicked again.
Try to imagine what this is like to the people in a place like China. My friend told me the other day, very carefully, that "there are some limitations" on what you can say here. We know it's true, there is censorship. China is opening up to the world, but they're doing it slowly and carefully.
The United States of America have shown the world that freedom doesn't work. We tried it, it didn't work, we're rolling it back.
I guarantee that's what they're thinking over here when they see this. If it doesn't work, why bother?
I was in my hotel room in Hefei, which is a small city of about a million people in Anhui Province, China. I was watching TV, which in China is just a hoot. Naturally you can't tell what they're saying, but they have these surrealistic stories, and you are constantly reminded that you are not in Kansas any more. It is really entertaining, sometimes it's old-times princes and princesses or evil warlords, or wacky contemporary love stories with ... crazy stuff. People fly, furniture talks, crazy fun magical stuff. Also, there's Chinese MTV and other more familiar programming.
Anyway, I was clicking the remote and I came across the news in English. It was read by a Chinese anchor and had Chinese reporters, but it was in English. This was the only time I've seen this here, though I admit I haven't watched a whole lot of television while I've been in this country.
So I sat here in China watching the President of the United States sign a bill allowing unlimited detention, without legal representation, of noncitizens, even those living in the United States, among other things. They can be put to death without being able to defend themselves. The Chinese lady read her script in near-perfect English, noting that some people considered the bill controversial.
He had a little banner hanging over his podium that said "Protecting America," as I recall.
Pretty soon it switched back to Mandarin, and I clicked again.
Try to imagine what this is like to the people in a place like China. My friend told me the other day, very carefully, that "there are some limitations" on what you can say here. We know it's true, there is censorship. China is opening up to the world, but they're doing it slowly and carefully.
The United States of America have shown the world that freedom doesn't work. We tried it, it didn't work, we're rolling it back.
I guarantee that's what they're thinking over here when they see this. If it doesn't work, why bother?
posted by JimK at 9:36 AM
52 Comments:
"The United States of America have shown the world that freedom doesn't work. We tried it, it didn't work, we're rolling it back.
I guarantee that's what they're thinking over here when they see this. If it doesn't work, why bother?"
Well, you could disabuse them of such a ridiculous idea.
I don't know about everyone else but I feel pretty free. Seems like everyone else in America also feels free to criticize that viscious dictator, George Bush. Not very scary for a mean old despot.
I am not so sure about freedom to criticize anymore. I wanted to speak to Michael Steele about the lies in his ads but having heard about arrests for a person who told Cheney the war in Iraq was bad and protesters who refused to hide from Jeb Bush- being stunned(by stun guns) - I did not speak to him. These were public places and no action beside standing and
speaking was reported as being the reason for these actions. I am still thinking about speaking out in public to Steele- his lies about his distance from Washington- (when I stood outside the RNC hdqtrs while Rove headlined a fundraiser for him ) are too much. I will wait until there is a large audience and witnesses so his state troopers think twice about doing anything when I use my constitutional rights to call Steele a liar.
"Seems like everyone else in America also feels free to criticize that viscious dictator, George Bush."
Voicing dissent is a freedom we still enjoy (in most cases) along with the right to own unregistered guns. However, there are freedoms we used to have that have been removed by the current administration and congress. These purloined freedoms include but are not limited to:
"FREEDOM OF ASSOCIATION: Government may monitor religious and political institutions without suspecting criminal activity to assist terror investigations.
FREEDOM OF INFORMATION: Government has closed once-public immigration hearings, has secretly detained hundreds of people without charges, and has encouraged bureaucrats to resist public records questions.
FREEDOM OF SPEECH: Government may prosecute librarians or keepers of any other records if they tell anyone that the government subpoenaed information related to a terror investigation.
RIGHT TO LEGAL REPRESENTATION: Government may monitor federal prison jailhouse conversations between attorneys and clients, and deny lawyers to Americans accused of crimes.
FREEDOM FROM UNREASONABLE SEARCHES: Government may search and seize Americans' papers and effects without probable cause to assist terror investigation.
RIGHT TO A SPEEDY AND PUBLIC TRIAL: Government may jail Americans indefinitely without a trial.
RIGHT TO LIBERTY: Americans may be jailed without being charged or being able to confront witnesses against them."
-Pastor Chuck Baldwin
http://www.newswithviews.com/baldwin/baldwin214.htm
Readers might be surprised to learn that Bob Barr, former GOP Congressman from Georgia, the insider who led the charge for Clinton's impeachment, now heads a group called "Patriots to Restore Checks and Balances."
"Mission:
To secure sound public policy that enables the government to fight terror while preserving important checks and balances on law enforcement, thus limiting undue government intrusion into the private lives of average Americans.
About Us
Patriots to Restore Checks and Balances (PRCB) is an alliance of individuals and organizations – conservatives and progressives - that believes the threat of terrorism cannot be allowed to dissolve or erode the carefully constructed structural foundations for preserving our liberty, enshrined forever in the Constitution.
Why We Formed this Alliance
We joined together in early 2005 to urge the Congress to carefully review and amend the USA Patriot Act – a law enacted 45 days after 9/11 that expanded the government’s ability to gather information on Americans. At that time, Congress voted overwhelmingly and purposefully to have certain provisions expire by the end of 2005 in order to give Congress a second chance to assess their impact on the traditional checks and balances on government powers that protect basic American freedoms. With the Patriot Act now signed into law, PRCB has turned its eye toward protecting Americans’ Constitutional freedoms when and wherever they are threatened.
What We Believe
We agree it is necessary to provide law enforcement with the resources it needs to defeat terrorism, but we are concerned that they are being allowed – by law – to go beyond that mission and infringe on the rights of law-abiding Americans in ways that raise serious constitutional and practical concerns.
“The emergence of international terrorism on our shores cannot be allowed to dissolve the carefully constructed structural foundations for preserving our liberty that are required by the Constitution; that very document our soldiers have sacrificed and continue to sacrifice their lives to protect.” Former Congressman Bob Barr (R-GA)
Chairman, Patriots to Restore Checks and Balances
Patriots to Restore Checks and Balances believes the focus of terrorism investigations should be terrorists – not average Americans. Today, the Patriot Act allows government to secretly search your home and collect a broad array of personal data, such as: medical records, gun ownership, library and financial records – even if you’re not suspected of a crime. And the National Security Agency may be conducting surveillance of your phone calls and e-mails without getting a warrant from a judge, in clear violation of federal law and our system of checks and balances.
We Urge Congress to Act
We urge Congress to restore traditional checks and balances on government power so the country can effectively fight terror without sacrificing the rights of innocent Americans, rights that are guaranteed by the Constitution."
Read more about it here:
http://www.checksbalances.org/
"I am still thinking about speaking out in public to Steele- his lies about his distance from Washington- (when I stood outside the RNC hdqtrs while Rove headlined a fundraiser for him ) are too much."
Well, you're free to speak to him. Of course, if he doesn't want to talk to you, he doesn't have to. Harassment is properly illegal.
Please, anon- there is a difference between harassment and being able to tell a public figure that he lied in a public statement. I guess you would figure that would be harassment. I guess if I was telling Hillary Clinton something negative- that wouldn't be harassment.
Well, they don't have a constitutional obligation to provide you an audience. You're free to protest and rally your fellow citizens to vote against them but they have the same right to free association as you. Even if you're not harassing them, they're free to not like you and try to avoid you.
Sorry, you'll have to try making yourself easier to like.
Interesting perspective on the APA. There is apparently another sexual aberration they do not represents a mental illness:
"There is presently considerable debate in psychology over whether certain aspects of bestiality are better understood as an aberration or as an orientation. The activity or desire itself is no longer classified as a pathology under DSM-IV (TR) (the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of the American Psychiatric Association) unless accompanied by distress or interference with normal functioning on the part of the person, and research has broadly been supportive of at least some of zoophiles' central claims."
This post has been removed by a blog administrator.
That's enough of that Anon. Go find a blog where they talk like that if that what's you want to do.
Keep it out of here.
Christine
There was no reason to remove the last post. It was a valid point. Many here have argued the normality of homosexual behavior by saying it has been observed in animla populations. As the last post pointed out, this is also true of other aberrant sexual behavior which virtually all would find offensive.
"talk like that"
Talk like what? I didn't write a word of the post. It was an excerpt from a Wikipedia entry, a common source used by the administrators of this blog.
Try making your point without violating COMAR.
http://www.dsd.state.md.us/comar/13a/13a.04.18.03.htm
Christine
What was the violation?
Ahh... so now we know what at least TTF thinks is "erotic techniques"...
anon, what we have been trying to get the boe to define for a while is what they believe the definition of "erotic techniques" are... apparently these are prohibited to be discussed by state law..so this all become relevant in what you can dicuss in a public school sex ed curriculum.
anal sex is apparently not an erotic technique, according to ttf, but bestiality is. It's nice to have some clarification on where ttf thinks the lines should be drawn. So where would rimming be classified ? erotic technique, or not ?
Theresa said...
Ahh... so now we know what at least TTF thinks is "erotic techniques"...
CRC Theresa---YOU THINK....
not concrete just YOU THINK.
Rimming is a obsession of Ruth Jacobs. That and swirlys
Brad
Anon's comment about "bestiality" was not deleted, but his description of a form of it was.
We have a single rule here Morons' Comments Will Be Deleted
There are websites all over the internet that will allow any and all sorts of speech. This is not one of them.
Christine
Correction:
Anon's comment about "bestiality" was not deleted, but his description of a form of "necrophilia" was.
Christine
"Anon's comment about "bestiality" was not deleted, but his description of a form of "necrophilia" was."
To clarify, the description wasn't mine but a excerpt from Wikipedia describing a scientist's observation of this behavior in animals. It didn't bother me that much but, anyway, Cilly is otherwise correct and I think everyone gets the idea: Like homosexuality, necrophilia has been observed in animal populations.
Anonymous at October 20, 2006 9:50 AM
So, what's your point - like heterosexuality necrophilia has been observed in animal populations.
According to Wikipedia, same sex behavior has been observed in over 1500 species of animals and it has been well documented in more than 500 species including mammals and human's close relatives, apes. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality
According to Wikipedia, necrophilia has been observed in one species of mallard as well as in the praying mantis. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necrophilia
Your attempt to equate the two is transparent.
Christine
Ok, so what does TTF define as erotic techniques ?
"So, what's your point - like heterosexuality necrophilia has been observed in animal populations."
My point, Randi, is that the comparison to animal behavior is irrelevant.
Anonymous at October 20, 2006 1:42 PM
Its relevant to the oft made claim that homosexuality is against nature. Clearly not the case.
Then neither is necrophilia
Anonymous at October 20, 2006 2:05 PM
I gather you must have missed the comment above by Cillygoose
I won't speak for TTF but, Theresa- there is a difference between saying a word and teaching it. COMAR does not allow teaching of erotic techniques. Do you think that saying the word algebra means you have taught it???
Anon- you don't get it- I can see your thought processes are lacking. Obviously, no one has to listen to my protest- but I have a right to say it once if it is non-violent -without worrying about being arrested, stunned or hurt by public "guards". Unfortunately, the nature of protection for some political figures has become that the public has no right to disagree with them in public.
Maybe this is Anon's problem, Randi.
"The problem with ideology is, if you got an ideology, you already got your mind made up. You know all the answers. And that makes evidence irrelevant and argument a waste of time." -- Bill Clinton
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15331093/
Aunt Bea
I love this logic...
We are going to mention it...
Swirlys (whatever the heck that means), anal sex, rimming, etc...
And that's okay. That's not teaching it.
Sounds like equivalent logic to the teacher resources are really not for the teachers to develop lesson plans from...
China.......what, are they giving you some kind of award for your socialism promoting efforts in the US, or did the Party Chairman recall you?
Jim is over in China as they want more information to begin teaching a full comprehensive sex education program in their schools.
CRC'rs were banned.
Brad
Theresa of CRC said Sounds like equivalent logic to the teacher resources are really not for the teachers to develop lesson plans from...
Theresa folks are bright enough to know the CRC game with that. So how about turning your light on upstairs? Or are you still busy trying to get Ruth Jacobs to explain that swirly to you or show it to you?
Your logic should be to get over it and accept that MCPS will put a full comprehensive sex ed progrma in place.
Brad
"Anon- you don't get it- I can see your thought processes are lacking. Obviously, no one has to listen to my protest- but I have a right to say it once if it is non-violent -without worrying about being arrested, stunned or hurt by public "guards". Unfortunately, the nature of protection for some political figures has become that the public has no right to disagree with them in public."
You seem to imply that is what's happening in Steele's case. It's not.
National figures are a little different. There's a world full of nuts trying to kill them. I agree that there are a handful of cases where the Secret Service have gone too far but if this were truly a repressive society, you'd have never heard of them. There are certainly plenty of forums in America where you can express your disagreement and rally your fellow citizens.
Maybe your desire to make a scene in public is just your social orientation and you can't help it and there's no cure for it.
"get over it and accept that MCPS will put a full comprehensive sex ed progrma in place."
So far, they've made many changes to accomodate CRC's objections. Once MCPS finally plays their cards, the public discussion can begin. Don't get ahead of yourself, Brad.
Theresa said...
Ahh... so now we know what at least TTF thinks is "erotic techniques"...
October 19, 2006 11:54 PM
Theresa said...
Ok, so what does TTF define as erotic techniques ?
October 20, 2006 12:32 PM
Theresa said...
I love this logic...
October 21, 2006 12:50 AM
Oh yeah, we all love this logic....
If you had been following the chain, you would have noted that between my first two posts someone had disagreed with my guess at what TTF thought were erotic techniques ...
necrophilia.
And what TTF didn't think were erotic techiques...
anal sex.
I don't believe the new curriculm, at least so far, mentions either.
What is an erotic technique is relevant because it is against state law to teach (or discuss... not sure exactly what the COMAR wording is).
So it is definitely relevant.
I assume rimming would count as an erotic technique. I don't know (and by the way don't want to know, Brad) what a swirly is so I can't comment.
If it is anywhere as gross as rimming I have no desire to know. And you are correct, it was Ruth that originally told me what rimming was .. since she gets to treat patients dying from sexually transmitted diseases she has to know.
Theresa
It should be clear to anyone reading this blog that TTF has no desire to introduce talk about "erotic techniques" of any kind in 8th or 10th grade classrooms. Some anonymous idiot here raised the issue of bestiality/necrophilia in a not-so-clever attempt to change the subject. As far as I'm concerned, the schools should talk about feelings that people have, including gay people, so that gay students will understand why they feel the way they do and so that straight students will be able to accept their gay classmates and have some understanding about what's going on.
As for "erotic techniques," I think there is a public health justification for teaching students what behaviors are dangerous in terms of disease and pregnancy, and for teaching students what preventative steps they can take, whether they are gay or straight -- and in these days of AIDS it seems there is a need to consider both sides of that divide carefully. This doesn't seem like a very controversial suggestion.
CRC has tried to blur the line between health and pornography since Day One, and I do not agree that that is a helpful approach to the subject. Sex-ed is not porn, it is instruction that affects the health of the public. We do not advocate a pornographic approach.
The comments about rimming and swirlies have to do with CRC's repeated -- many times -- presentations to the school board about feces-eating and other disgusting and irrelevant behaviors, in an apparent attempt to make all of sex seem too repulsive to be discussed in a classroom. "Swirlies" was your group's discussion of a child's game of shoving someone's head in the toilet and flushing it; apparently for CRC this is what sex is like, at least that's the way your rep described it to the school board.
Anon's attempt to slime the gay population by linking their feelings to some bizarre paraphilia is not kind, and it is not helpful for anyone's understanding of the situation.
JimK
Theresa is "not sure exactly what the COMAR wording is"
Using the link to COMAR provided above:
13A.04.18.03
.03 Implementation of the Goal and Subgoals of Regulation .02F.
A. The content of programs shall be organized around three areas of focus, namely, interpersonal relationships, physiological and personality changes, and advanced physiology and psychology of human sexual behavior. Each area shall be handled in a distinctly different manner, and the program shall be related to and coordinated with other appropriate areas in the curriculum.
B. The focus areas in §A of this regulation are as follows:
(1) Focus Area One—Interpersonal Relationships.
(a) The content shall:
(i) Be concerned with family life and interpersonal relationships both within and outside the family;
(ii) Be a part of the regular curriculum for all students in grades kindergarten through 12, taught in mixed groups, and included within the framework of existing subject areas; and
(iii) Differ in kind and design according to the maturity of students.
(b) Discussions in §B(1)(a) of this regulation shall encourage respect for personal relationships within a student's family and may not invade the privacy of the family.
(c) The following areas shall be emphasized in each program of the local school system:
(i) Self-respect;
(ii) Mutual respect;
(iii) Consideration of the needs of others;
(iv) Affection and love;
(v) Variety of family structures and roles of family members;
(vi) Male and female roles in American society; and
(vii) Moral and ethical implications of behavior.
(2) Focus Area Two—Physiological and Personality Changes.
(a) The content shall be concerned with the physiological and personality changes related to maturation and human reproduction, with material being presented as an identifiable unit within the total program. This unit shall be introduced as shortly in advance of puberty as is practical. The specific timing is a matter of local option, but direct teaching of human reproduction may not begin earlier than age 10 or later than age 12.
(b) The local school system shall develop a prescribed procedure for consultation and discussion with community groups relative to the program of human reproduction. If a separation of the sexes is made, the same information shall be presented to both groups.
(c) Students may be excused from this unit of the program upon a written request from their parents/guardians. For students excused from the unit, the local school shall provide other worthwhile learning activities, such as independent study on a topic in a health area or another area of student interests or needs. The local school shall make arrangements to permit those girls not participating in the total program in Focus Area Two to receive instruction concerning menstruation.
(d) The following areas of emphasis shall be included in each program of the local school system:
(i) Physical maturation;
(ii) Emotional maturation;
(iii) Human reproduction;
(iv) The birth process;
(v) Infant care;
(vi) Growth and development during early childhood; and
(vii) The physiology of aging.
(3) Focus Area Three—Advanced Physiology and Psychology of Human Sexual Behavior.
(a) The content shall be concerned with the advanced physiology and psychology of human sexual behavior and related matters and may be offered as an elective course at the middle or high school level, or both. However, it shall differ in kind and degree according to the level of maturity of the students.
(b) Other aspects of sexual behavior related to Focus Area Three shall be offered in an identifiable elective course. A student who chooses this course shall have the prior consent of the student's parents/guardians. The elective course may be taught separately to boys and girls, but shall include the same information for both groups. It shall be offered several times each school year to make it available to as many students as possible. Erotic techniques of human intercourse may not be discussed. All instruction shall be objective and carefully supervised.
(c) The following areas of emphasis shall be included in each program of the local school system:
(i) Maturation;
(ii) The reproductive process;
(iii) Sexual variations;
(iv) Contraception;
(v) Premarital intercourse;
(vi) Marriage and family responsibilities;
(vii) Family planning; and
(viii) Sexually transmitted diseases.
(d) The local school system shall study present courses in which the information in §B(3)(c) is now included to determine which elements might more appropriately remain in these courses. Biology teachers, for example, might continue to teach the reproductive process.
(e) Adult Education. A course concerning family life and human development shall be offered, if funds are available, by local school systems as part of an adult education program. This course may provide parents/guardians with an opportunity to strengthen their backgrounds of information in the subject matter. The course may also increase parent/guardian competencies to answer their child's questions more effectively and to understand their child's behavior. The adult course may serve as a means through which parents/guardians may inform themselves of the most effective means to convey sound emotional attitudes about human sexuality to their children.
C. Selection of Curricular Material.
(1) The local school system shall establish procedures for evaluating and selecting instructional materials to be used in all courses.
(2) The local school system shall appoint a joint committee of educators and representatives of the community that shall examine all instructional materials proposed to be used in the schools. The committee's recommendations shall be submitted to the local superintendent of schools and the local board of education for final action. The local school system shall use its existing procedures for evaluating reading levels, factual content, and general suitability of material for different levels of instruction.
(3) The instructional materials shall meet the following established criteria:
(a) Material may not be used in the elementary grades that portrays the male and female sex organs in juxtaposition, and material may not be used at any level that discusses or portrays erotic techniques of sexual intercourse;
(b) The school shall provide special opportunities for parents/guardians to view all instructional materials to be used in the program before the materials are used in the classroom;
(c) Materials used shall be consistent with the goal and subgoals described in Regulation .02F of this chapter;
(d) The materials shall be chosen with regard to reading ability and level of understanding of students who are to use the materials;
(e) The local school system shall publish at regular intervals a list of its approved instructional materials.
D. Community Involvement.
(1) System-Wide Citizen Advisory Committee. The curriculum shall be developed by professional educators within the local school system. A citizen advisory committee broadly representing the views of the community shall consult with these educators in developing, implementing, and evaluating the program. Membership may represent groups such as parents/ guardians, students, legislators, members of community organizations, clergy, physicians, and members of professional and civic organizations.
(2) Local School/Community Planning Groups.
(a) After a system-wide curriculum is established, local school administrators and local PTAs or similar groups shall develop a community planning group. After studying the system-wide program, this group shall propose a plan for its maintenance in the local school.
(b) The school/community planning group shall provide a means for the community to study State regulations, State standards and procedures, local policy statements and guidelines, curriculum guides or course outlines, sample test materials, and all approved instructional materials.
(c) The group shall present the proposed program to the local school community. The school/community planning group shall later develop periodic progress reports on what is being taught, to be distributed to parents/guardians of students participating in the program. This group shall also participate in developing a means for evaluating the program.
E. Teacher Selection, Assignment, and Training.
(1) The local school system shall develop guidelines and procedures for the selection of qualified teachers, and because the teacher is a vital factor in the program, qualifications such as the following shall be considered:
(a) Two years of successful teaching experience;
(b) Appropriate specialized training;
(c) Good rapport with students; and
(d) Respect and trust of parents/guardians.
(2) The assignment of teachers is the responsibility of the local superintendent of schools, who shall consider the recommendations of the school principal and the supervisors working in the school. A teacher may not be assigned to teach in either of the specialized areas (Focus Areas Two and Three) if the teacher feels inadequate or uncomfortable with the subject matter.
(3) In Focus Area Two and Focus Area Three, in addition to general teacher preparation, teachers teaching an identifiable unit or course are required to have had additional preparation in content and teaching methods of such depth and duration as to be appropriate for the course to be taught. The additional preparation may be provided by college courses, local in-service programs, State workshops, and continual staff assistance.
(4) The local school system shall establish such planned and continuous programs as required to train adequately its personnel (teachers, administrators, and supervisors) in order to update knowledge, instructional materials, and methodology.
http://www.dsd.state.md.us/comar/13a/13a.04.18.03.htm
"Anon's attempt to slime the gay population by linking their feelings to some bizarre paraphilia is not kind, and it is not helpful for anyone's understanding of the situation."
Not trying to slime the gay population at all. Just trying to slime the fallacious arguments used to advance the agenda. But then, you know that.
"The APA has decided homosexuality is normal and not a disease": truth is, the APA has decided the same about all kinds of bizarre behavior. Therefore, this statement, which TTF wants to present as a fact to high school students is meaningless. You don't want to teach them that APA has decided bestiality is not a disease.
"Homosexuality is normal because animals have been observed doing it." : Scientists have observed animals doing all kinds of bizarre things. This is not relevant to the human condition.
Again, the conversation was started by TTF. Disingenuous to accuse anyone else of "sliming" when you brought up the topic of the APA and animal behavior.
Anonymous at October 22, 2006 10:11 PM
Anonymous the gay agenda (as others have said) is to seek equal treatement, not to be fired from one's job, or evicted from a rental accomodation, or to be treated as a criminal for acts of love. For you to slime this agenda is to slime gays, you're just to much of a coward to admit that, let alone to identify yourself with your comments.
Of course what animals do isn't always relevant to the human condition, but sometimes it is. Animals eat, sleep, survive, care for their young, play, work, look out for each other. We share much more in common with animals than those things in which we differ. Having sex (gay or straight) solely for the enjoyment of it is one of those things we do. Sex and love are connected, its one of the ties that bind, it frequently brings people together into mutually supportive relationships and that is a good thing to be encouraged, not blindly opposed with hate as you do.
"Disingenuous to accuse anyone else of "sliming" when you brought up the topic of the APA and animal behavior."
Nice spin. Try some truth.
TTF invited the Chairman of the American Medical Association's Advisory Committee on Gay Lesbian Bisexual and Transgender issues concerning patients, medical students, and physicians to speak at our educational forum September 25, 2005. Dr. Paul Wertsch's powerpoint presentation discussed the fact that many species on earth exhibit same sex behavior. His presentation can be found on the RESOURCES page of this website.
It was an Anonymous commenter on October 19, 2006 at 7:51 PM above in this blog thread who brought up the APA and bestiality and then a bit later, at 8:28 PM posted a description of a form of necrophilia in a transparent attempt to slime LGBT people.
If this is your idea of morality, Anon, you can keep it.
Christine
Cilly
I don't see what you're talking about. Wertsch indeed brought up animal behavior as justification for the normality of homosexuality. Why then wouldn't it follow that other animal behaviors are normal? The spin is all yours. When a phenemonena backs your agenda, it's wonderful. When it doesn't, it's immoral. Meanwhile, the lies about science that TTF pushes leads young adults to give up and pursue a destructive lifestyle.
Anonymous at October 23, 2006 11:09 PM it was explained to you earlier at October 20, 2006 11:45 AM but you chose to ignore it. Its you that keeps spinning with your ignorant references to a destructive lifestyle. My relationship, is wonderful loving and supportive. Most heterosexuals should wish to have a relationship like I do with my boyfriend. In no way can it be considered destructive, that's sheer ignorance, relationships like ours are to be encouraged, supported and highly valued by society.
anonymous said So far, they've made many changes to accomodate CRC's objections
Well be if for you anonymous to think that CRC is the only one on CAC.
Cackle Cackle
Brad
anonymous said Meanwhile, the lies about science that TTF pushes leads young adults to give up and pursue a destructive lifestyle.
Oh yeah we just know the truth spews from you anonymous. That is why you go by anonymous.
Explain with any truth the line
(Lie you put forth) "TTF pushes leads young adults to give up and pursue a destructive lifestyle"
Brad
Anyone who reads this thread of comments can see that you tried to equate the significance of observed behavior across 1500 species to the observed behavior of 2 species.
It's too bad you "don't see" what I'm talking about. Everybody else does.
Christine
What difference does the number of species make? It just means there has been more energy expelled trying to justify the gay agenda. I doubt anyone has taken a serious look at necrophilia. Point remains: animal behavior doesn't equal acceptable human behavior. How many species have been observed engaging in cannibalism of their own species?
Anonymous at October 24, 2006 9:59 AM
No one was saying all animal behavior is acceptable human behavior. Its you that keeps trying to suggest all animal behavior is unacceptable in humans. Need I remind you that animals engage in heterosexual behavior, I don't hear you equating that with cannibalism and necrophilia.
Thanks, Randi. So the next time one of these lunatics say homosexuality is perfectly normal because animals do it, we'll correct them.
Anonymous at October 25, 2006 11:16 AM
The fact that homosexuality is wide spread in animials suggests it is normal or natural. I'd be the first to admit that what is normal and natural is not necessarily good but in the case of homosexuality as in heterosexuality as long as its done in a responsible caring way its a good thing for society and the couple involved.
"its a good thing for society"
Could you explain how homosexuality is good for society?
Anonymous at October 26, 2006 6:52 AM
When two people come together in a committed romantic sexual relationship (whether homosexual or heterosexual) they help, support, and love each other. This makes the couple happier and more productive. Happy productive people give more to society than unhappy unproductive people. This is good for society and the individuals involved.
Post a Comment
<< Home