Representing on the Tube

Man, I'll tell you, this was one time I was glad to be out of town. Channel Seven called and wanted somebody to go on TV to discuss the new curriculum with somebody from the CRC. Since I was out in Hawaii, I had an excuse -- I hate these things. I don't like to watch TV, and I don't like being on it. Christine Grewell was brave enough to volunteer for this one, and she did great. Not that it's her first time. She was on CNN, PBS, she was on Laura Ingraham's show, she was on NPR, she's been on a number of shows and has been interviewed by the various media, representing our point of view. Probably more than me, actually. She's definitely better at it than I am.

Here's a transcript of the show, which was broadcast this morning. I'm going to throw in my inappropriate and sarcastic comments, as usual.

Kathleen Matthews: ...From the WJLA Broadcast Center in Arlington, Virginia, I’m Kathleen Matthews in for Leon Harris. Teaching children about sex has always been a controversial topic and especially sensitive these days in Montgomery County where for the past three years, parents and educators have battled over adding lessons on homosexuality to the curriculum. Now after a slew of lawsuits, committee meetings, and Board of Education hearings, students this month have finally started that new sex-ed curriculum. But the opposition hasn’t backed down. You can expect to see more lawsuits and challenges as they proceed. The question here is should middle school students be learning about homosexuality in school or is Montgomery County pushing the limits on a taboo topic that perhaps should be taught at home? Joining us today are two parents on both sides of this issues: Christine Grewell of Teach The Facts, she’s in favor of the program and John Garza’s an attorney for the Citizens for a Responsible Curriculum and he’s opposed. John, tell us first of all your investment in this topic.

John Garza: I have three children and I live in Montgomery County. I have two daughters age 9 and 8 and also a son who’s 6 years old so they’ll be heading into this curriculum in the near future.

Amazing. Garza's kids don't go to public school -- one sentence into the interview, and there he goes. His kids won't be "heading into this curriculum" -- ever.

Christine Grewell: I also have three children, two that have already graduated. They were K through 12 in the county. And I have a 10th grader.

KM: So we got those facts on the table. Tell me, John, what your major objection or major fear about this being taught in school is.

JG: We have two major problems with the new curriculum. The first problem is it teaches facts that are just not correct. And then the other problem that we have is, is that by encouraging homosexuality, it tramples on those who have religious beliefs that are in direct contradiction to that so...

Note: it takes a certain kind of mind to see no inconsistency in the concept of "facts that are just not correct."

KM: Now I want to stop you there because you said “encouraging homosexuality.” Does the curriculum really encourage it?

JG: I think so...I think...

KM: How?

JG: Well if you read the curriculum, for example, the Portia, the boy who wants to become a girl. This part of the curriculum talks about how when he came out as a girl it was very good feelings that he had and how wonderful it was and how everyone rallied around him – or her – to make him feel better and the teachers gave him a unisex bathroom key and it was almost like a great coming of age story for this person. If a, if a child is taught that...

KM: You think that’s promoting it.

JG: We think that’s promoting it, yes.

I will note here that homosexuality is not even mentioned in the Portia vignette. And the teachers let her use the faculty restroom ... wow, that is bad.

The CRC hates that Portia vignette, because it makes a transgender person seem real. It forces the reader to think for a minute about what it's like for someone who is trying to deal with their gender identity, which is different from the other kids'.

And listen, if reading a vignette from a textbook makes a boy want to turn into a girl ... oh, never mind.

CG: Well, my understanding is that about 93% of American parents would like to have sex education taught in the schools and of those about 73% think that homosexuality and sexual orientation should also be taught at the schools. I think it s a good idea to give kids enough information to make well-informed choices about what they’re going to do in their life and I think this curriculum will go a long way to helping the LGBT kids that are students at MCPS that currently are ignored and stigmatized...

Ah, there goes that Teach the Facts lady again, making sense.

But of course we are fascinated to learn more about the CRC view.

KM: John, John, tell me what you think about that because some would add to that argument that you know, they’re surrounded by it in popular culture so they’re going to get the message from someplace if not from school.

JG: Well we’re not opposed to teaching sex education in the school. We’ve never been opposed to it. We just want factually correct information given to the students and also just stay away from the religious implications of homosexuality. If they could do those two things we would probably back away and not be opposed any more.

Yeah, well, good, because neither of those two things are in the curriculum. Facts are well supported, and there is absolutely nothing about religion or contradicting any religion. So back away already.

KM: Do you think there’s a good way to teach about homosexuality in school?

JG: It’s very difficult to teach about homosexuality without stepping on someone’s toes. You have the homosexual community who want to teach tolerance and embracing their lifestyle. If you do that you’re going to step on the toes of many religious folks who are taught on Sunday that homosexual conduct is a sin so you run right into that major problem.

He wishes that was a problem. But it's not. Nothing in the curriculum says anything one way or the other about whether it's a sin to be gay. You can believe that if you want, but you will learn the names of a couple of things in these classes, and you will spend a few minutes in your short life thinking about what it is like to be gay, or transgender, in America today.

By the way, the idea that the "homosexual community" want to "teach tolerance and embracing their lifestyle" -- I am not aware of anyone from the "homosexual community" taking part in this debate at all. Oh, they're watching, but it is a lie to depict this controversy as a conflict between the Christians and the "homosexual community." This is between parents who want the facts stated, objectively and fairly, and parents who want to sweep the whole topic under the table and stigmatize some members of our community.

Or, another way you could look at it is: this is between parents whose kids attend public schools and take the health classes, and parents whose kids don't.

KM: Christine, let me get you to jump in here. Do you agree with this or do you think there’s a danger in not teaching about homosexuality in terms of maybe arming kids with information about safe sex for example?

CG: Oh, I know that there is danger to having kids not get information that’s going to help them make wise decision about their own health and safety.

KM: What are the dangers do you think for kids, for teenager or preteens?

CG: Well for example, one thing that we’re adding to the curriculum this time is a demonstration of the proper use of a condom and I think that that’s a life skill that every student should learn. They may not use it – hopefully they won’t use it before graduation, but it’s something that they’re going to need to learn.

Yikes -- she's making sense again!

Quick -- somebody say something nutty.

KM: What about that John? Do you object to that?

JG: No, I think that we need to teach kids how to use a condom, how to protect themselves. But we want to give them proper factual information, for example, the current, the new curriculum teaches children that anal sex and vaginal sex are equally safe if you use a condom. There is no factual information to back that up. We submitted information from the Surgeon General, from CDC, from NIH, and in fact the condom manufacturers themselves will tell you that there is no proof that using a condom in anal sex is as safe as vaginal. What we want to do is tell the students that there is a big difference. It may not be as safe in the form of anal sex so at least be honest with the students that they’re not the same.

OK, here's a serious question: why do they lie?

There is no place in the curriculum that says that "anal sex and vaginal sex are equally safe if you use a condom." He has totally invented that, and presented it on TV as a fact.

How do they live with themselves?

Tell you the truth, I think Christine set a little trap for him. We should have taken bets ahead of time -- how quickly can she get the CRC guy to start talking about anal sex. They love to talk about anal sex, it's weird. She knew when she said "condom" that he would have to say "anal sex." Hammer to kneecap. Bam-bam-bam, he said it three times in one paragraph.

The fact is, there's no proof that a condom is any less effective for anal sex than for vaginal sex, and it is good, mainstream advice to recommend using one in either case. The government sites recommend it, your doctor recommends it. There's no real controversy there, except that the CRC loves to say the phrase "anal sex," and wants the schools to teach about it.

KM: Let me just talk as we wrap up here about self-image. You’re talking about children that are coming of age, prepubescent kids who are maybe discovering their sexuality and may be confused about who they are and whether they are normal. Does teaching them about homosexuality ease some children through that process do you think? That it is something that some kids will grow up to be?

JG: Well yeah. We know that students about that age, about 25% of them are really not sure what their sexual orientation is but we know that by the time they reach my age, only about 1-3% are actually going to go into the homosexual lifestyle. It’s a very...it’s in a time when we’ve got to be very careful on how we push them in. Now what this program does is it encourages them to self-label what their orientation is in 8th or 10th grade. That’s too young. People shouldn’t be talked into labeling their orientation at that age.

Wow. How do they live with themselves?

Where to start?

First of all, these statistics. By age 18-19, according to this NCHS Survey, 94.4 percent of males reported themselves as heterosexual, bisexual, or homosexual. 3.5 percent said "something else," and 2.1 percent didn't answer the question. So, by nineteen ... they know. Other surveys find about half the "unsure" high-school-age adolescents that Garza mentions, and at least twice the number of gays in the adult population.

And that phrase about "how we push them in." Push them into what? Does he think somebody becomes gay because they were "pushed into" it? That's bizarre.

We have talked a lot on this blog about the CRC's charge that the classes encourage students to "self-label." It's simply a lie. There is nothing anywhere in any of these classes that would encourage anybody to label themselves -- in fact, the curriculum goes out of its way to make the point that you can discover your sexual orientation at any time in your life. You might not know in tenth grade, no big deal, you'll figure it out when the time comes. The accusation that anybody would be "talked into labeling their orientation at that age" is simply fiction, and he knows it.

KM: Christine, with the last word on that.

CG: Actually with the curriculum – when you read the curriculum, it says that some students or some people identify at an early age and other do not identify themselves as homosexual until after they’ve been adult for many years. So if you read the curriculum, you’ll find out what it really says and I encourage all parents to do so, to be informed.

KM: I applaud both of you for caring enough about the kids to get involved in this issue. Thanks very much.

Wham! Yes. If you're concerned about this, just ... read ... the ... curriculum. We've got it on the Internet, broken down into easy-to-handle pieces, HERE. The whole thing, including court documents.

This is just more evidence of the CRC's disregard for facts. They will say anything, because they feel they have to win. It doesn't matter what the people of the community believe, or what is really in the curriculum -- none of that matters, the only thing that matters is stopping the school district from teaching this new information.

Congratulations to Christine for representing TTF perfectly well.