What an Actual Socialist Thinks of Obama
Interesting interview by Patricia Murphy at Politics Daily. Here's the set-up for it:
You ought to read the interview, it gives you an idea what an actual socialist thinks about all this, especially relevant in comparison to what the Glenn Becks of the world say.
If a space alien landed on American soil tomorrow, it could be forgiven for thinking the president of the United States also represents a place called "Socialism."
A quick tour of the web turns up hundreds of socialist-inspired images of Barack Obama-- Obama as Che Guevara on "Che Obama Socialist" t-shirts; Obama as a radical Marxist at Obama4Socialism.net. Even the Investor's Business Daily penned a series of editorials on the Obama agenda called, "The Audacity of Socialism."
And when President Obama announced he'd be giving a back-to-school message to students, now-famous Florida GOP'er, Jim Greer, said it would "spread President Obama's socialist ideology."
So if the United States has elected a socialist president, the socialists must be pretty excited, right? Claiming just a single U.S. Senator (Vermonter Bernie Sanders) and exactly zero members of the House of Representatives as their own, putting a socialist in the White House would represent the greatest achievement of any socialist alive today.
But there's just one problem. The socialists won't claim Obama as their own. They won't even call him a socialist.
Frank Llewellyn, the National Director of the Democratic Socialists of America, the country's largest socialist organization, said Obama is most definitely not one of them. "He's not any kind of socialist at all," Llewellyn told me this week. He called the president "a market guy," which is hardly a compliment coming from a man with serious reservations about market capitalism.
"He's not challenging the power of the corporations," Llewellyn added. "The banking reforms that have been suggested are not particularly far reaching. He says we must have room for innovation, but we had innovation -- look where it got us. So I just...I can't..I mean it's laugh out loud, really."
Llewellyn offered his belief that Republicans have historically called opponents "socialists" in order to stop moderate reforms, and that the new stickiness of the Obama/socialist association is one part misinformation, one part ignorance. "The Republicans are doing the same thing they did when Roosevelt was president -- confusing somebody who is trying to save capitalism from itself with somebody who is trying to destroy it. (Obama) is not trying to destroy capitalism."
Llewellyn did, however, have kind words for GOP Chairman Michael Steele, to whom he suggested -- and it sounded only half-in-jest -- he owes a thank you note. "We have more media attention as a result of this stuff than anything else in the last 10 years," he said. Top U.S. Socialist Says Barack Obama is Not One of Them
You ought to read the interview, it gives you an idea what an actual socialist thinks about all this, especially relevant in comparison to what the Glenn Becks of the world say.
posted by JimK at 2:55 PM
16 Comments:
"the National Director of the Democratic Socialists of America, the country's largest socialist organization, said Obama is most definitely not one of them"
Surprise, surprise.
They're not going to say anything to prevent him from enacting their agenda.
"He's not challenging the power of the corporations,"
He does nothing but attack corporations. He basically blames the whole health care mess on corporate officers at insurance companies when the problem is, like the mortgage mess, the result of governmental intervention.
He's actually nationalized the sixth largest corporation in America and is the largest stockholder in several others.
Come on. Let's get real.
Hey, look.
Mr Free Market wants to destroy the Coca-Cola Company:
"(Sept. 9) -- As he fights a heated battle to get Congress to pass health care reform, President Barack Obama seems warm to another health-related idea: a so-called sin tax on soda and other sugary drinks.
In an interview with Men's Health magazine, Obama called a tax on soda "an idea that we should be exploring.""
Basically, like so many radicals, Obama has abandoned the idea that freedom is more important than the welfare of the masses.:
"Some self-ordained professor's tongue
too serious to fool
spouted out that liberty
is just equality in school.
Equality
I spoke the word
as if a wedding vow
ah, but I was so much older then
I'm younger
than that
now"
You see, many Americans go to college and come down with a bad case of socialism.
Most recover.
Barry did not.
Everything Anon says about Barack Obama was said about Franklin D. Roosevelt.
FDR saved American Capitalism by creating mechanisms which kept it from devouring itself and kept it from being so exploitative that a revolution could have resulted, destroying it. (Remember, this was a very real and legitimate concern in the 1930s, when both Soviet Communism and Nazi Fascism were in the ascendency.)
It has been 76 years since the New Deal began. In recent decades, political leaders have increasingly forgotten the lessons of the New Deal. What President Obama is doing is remembering those lessons and adapting them to the 21st Century.
"FDR saved American Capitalism by creating mechanisms which kept it from devouring itself and kept it from being so exploitative that a revolution could have resulted, destroying it."
You must be thinking of TR.
FDR exacerbated the depression and prolonged it.
What saved us was the driving force of the efficiencies brought upon us as necessary to combat the Axis powers.
And the fact that, of all the particpants, ours was the only homeland left undevastated.
The editors of the Economist magazine say America's healthcare debate has become a touch delirious, with people accusing each other of being evil-mongers, dealers in death, and un-American.
Well, that's charitable.
I would say it's more deranged than delirious, and definitely not un-American.
Those crackpots on the right praying for Obama to die and be sent to hell -- they're the warp and woof of home-grown nuttiness. So is the creature from the Second Amendment who showed up at the President's rally armed to the teeth. He's certainly one of us. Red, white and blue kooks are as American as apple pie and conspiracy theories.
Bill Maher asked me on his show last week if America is still a great nation. I should have said it's the greatest show on earth. Forget what you learned in civics about the Founding Fathers — we're the children of Barnum and Bailey, our founding con men. Their freak show was the forerunner of today's talk radio.
Speaking of which: We've posted on our Web site an essay ( http://www.truthout.org/090209R?n ) by the media scholar Henry Giroux. He describes the growing domination of hate radio as one of the crucial elements in a "culture of cruelty" increasingly marked by overt racism, hostility and disdain for others, coupled with a simmering threat of mob violence toward any political figure who believes healthcare reform is the most vital of safety nets, especially now that the central issue of life and politics is no longer about working to get ahead, but struggling simply to survive.
So here we are, wallowing in our dysfunction. Governed -- if you listen to the rabble rousers -- by a black nationalist from Kenya smuggled into the United States to kill Sarah Palin's baby. And yes, I could almost buy their belief that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, only I think he shipped them to Washington, where they've been recycled as lobbyists and trained in the alchemy of money laundering, which turns an old-fashioned bribe into a First Amendment right.
Only in a fantasy capital like Washington could Sunday morning talk shows become the high church of conventional wisdom, with partisan shills treated as holy men whose gospel of prosperity always seems to boil down to lower taxes for the rich.
Poor Obama. He came to town preaching the religion of nice. But every time he bows politely, the harder the Republicans kick him.
No one's ever conquered Washington politics by constantly saying "pretty please" to the guys trying to cut your throat.
Let's get on with it, Mr. President. We're up the proverbial creek with spaghetti as our paddle. This healthcare thing could have been the crossing of the Delaware, the turning point in the next American Revolution -- the moment we put the mercenaries to rout, as Gen. Washington did the Hessians at Trenton. We could have stamped our victory "Made in the USA." We could have said to the world, "Look what we did!" And we could have turned to each other and said, "Thank you."
As it is, we're about to get healthcare reform that measures human beings only in corporate terms of a cost-benefit analysis. I mean, this is topsy-turvy -- we should be treating health as a condition, not a commodity.
As we speak, Pfizer, the world's largest drug maker, has been fined a record $2.3 billion as a civil and criminal -- yes, that's criminal, as in fraud -- penalty for promoting prescription drugs with the subtlety of the Russian mafia. It's the fourth time in a decade Pfizer's been called on the carpet. And these are the people into whose tender mercies Congress and the White House would deliver us?
Come on, Mr. President. Show us America is more than a circus or a market. Remind us of our greatness as a democracy. When you speak to Congress next week, just come out and say it. We thought we heard you say during the campaign last year that you want a government-run insurance plan alongside private insurance -- mostly premium-based, with subsidies for low-and-moderate income people. Open to all individuals and employees who want to join and with everyone free to choose the doctors we want. We thought you said Uncle Sam would sign on as our tough, cost-minded negotiator standing up to the cartel of drug and insurance companies and Wall Street investors whose only interest is a company's share price and profits.
Here's a suggestion, Mr. President: Ask Josh Marshall to draft your speech. Josh is the founder of the Web site TalkingPointsMemo.com. He's a journalist and historian, not a politician. He doesn't split things down the middle and call it a victory for the masses. He's offered the simplest and most accurate description yet of a public insurance plan -- one that essentially asks people: Would you like the option -- the voluntary option -- of buying into Medicare before you're 65? Check it out, Mr. President.
This healthcare thing is make or break for your leadership, but for us, it's life and death. No more Mr. Nice Guy, Mr. President. We need a fighter.
-- By Bill Moyers
My principal point is not about what ended the Depression, although even at the height of the late 1930s recession, the unemployment rate was half of what it was when Roosevelt took office.
Rather, my point is that the regulatory structure established by FDR provided the framework that fostered effective, responsible capitalism for more than 40 decades, until it began to be dismantled under Reagan.
David
Capitalism is not just simple chaos. As TR showed us, it needs to be maintained.
But Obama is not seeking to regulate capitalism. He seeks te replace it.
Help ensure Congress doesn't turn into a screaming town hall meeting.
ever watch Parliament proceedings?
they scream at each other regularly
and they've got exactly the kind of health care Sir Barry wants for you
Leave it to a repugnican to heartily import the rancor of the British legislature while ignoring what they've learned over the past 50 years about how to provide healthcare to every citizen.
I'm sure South Carolina's Joe Wilson is enjoying the tasty crow he started devouring as soon as the President's speech ended last night. His website crashed last night and back home, the uproar turned into a boon for Democrat Rob Miller, Joe Schmo's opponent in next year's midterm elections. Miller raised over $200,000 from 5,000 individual contributions since Joe's classless outburst last night.
It seems that if there's one thing Congress can agree upon it's that insulting the U.S. president when he speaks to Congress is beyond the pale. Former presidential candidate John McCain (R-Ariz.) quickly demanded that Joe Wilson apologize to President Obama for shouting "You lie!" during the president's speech. Wilson ultimately apologized through Obama's chief of staff Rahm Emmanuel.
House Majority Whip James Clyburn (D-S.C.) complained that Rep. Wilson's conduct brought South Carolina's reputation to a new low.
But it wasn't just the Congress that was offended by Joe Wilson's breach of decorum. According to CNN, the American public let loose a firestorm of criticism of Joe Wilson's disrespectful conduct. The Joe Wilson wikipedia entry saw repeated modifications, first one describing him as a "(expletive deleted) who called the president a liar on national television..." and then one saying "You are disrespectful, Sir." Wikipedia quickly disabled editing options on the Joe Wilson entry to prevent further modifications, CNN said.
Twitter and Facebook were also inundated with Joe Wilson "You lie!" outburst commentary, most of it highly critical.
Wilson's remark was uncivil and uncalled for.
Still, it will probably work to the favor of opponents of Obamacare because Democrats will over-react, bringing a lot of attention to the incident.
The net effect is that most voters will think "that guy shouldn't have said that" and will have a lingering, subliminal impression that Obama lied.
When will Democrats ever learn?
Interesting point but a fruitless one. Democrats won't overplay the comment half as much as those who support what Wilson did.
These town hall things and other tactics are classic out of the Art of War - if up against a superior opponent, annoy him enough to get him off of his game.
But as you can see, the President also read that part of the Art of War and is focused like a laser.
As James Mason said to Cary Grant in "North by Northwest", so America says to Democrats:
"did you know you badly overplay your hand?"
America didn't vote to become an far left country.
Your congressman's outburst is not a major event.
Your friends will vote for him again.
"A day after Rep. Joe Wilson (R-S.C.) yelled "You lie!" during the president's televised speech to Congress, Republican strategists are expressing dismay that "whack jobs" and "cranks" are defining the public's perception of the party. The concern has been growing throughout August, when "birthers" and "death panels" were the talk of the town, and town-hall meetings on health care were repeatedly disrupted by angry conservative protesters.
"Neither party has an exclusive on whack jobs," Republican media consultant Mark McKinnon told Politico. "Unfortunately, right now the Democrats generally get defined by President Obama, and Republicans, who have no clear leadership, get defined by crackpots -- and then they begin to define the Republican Party in the mind of the general public."
The party's message-makers, already frustrated by lawmakers giving credence to the hysteria of fringe constituents, saw the antics of some GOP congressmen at Wednesday night's speech as the ultimate confirmation of their fears. Even worse, it had racist undertones, a veteran Republican official said: "The image of a bunch of white guys booing an African-American president is about as bad as it gets."
Texas Sen. John Cornyn, however, says the damage that the cranks are doing to the party is temporary, and will be quickly forgotten once new Republican candidates emerge and begin setting the agenda. "Right now there's sort of a void because that hasn't formed yet," he said."
""A day after Rep. Joe Wilson (R-S.C.) yelled "You lie!" during the president's televised speech to Congress, Republican strategists are expressing dismay that "whack jobs" and "cranks" are defining the public's perception of the party."
When Wilson called Obama a liar, in the middle of his speech, it was a break with the ordinary decorum of an insitution that is actually a bit pompous.
It must be the singularity that is being decried, however, because George Bush was booed during addresses to Congress on more than one occassion.
Furthermore, rudeness and lunacy are not the same thing. You don't have to a "whack job" or "crank" to see Obama is lying about his health proposals. Fact checkers and economic experts tried fruitlessly all day yesterday to get the White House to explain how his numbers add up. (hint: they don't)
Was it rude to call the President a liar though? He accused his opponents of lying before, during and after the speech as has the extreme left Democratic leadership.
I guess Barry can dish it out but not take it.
"The concern has been growing throughout August, when "birthers" and "death panels" were the talk of the town, and town-hall meetings on health care were repeatedly disrupted by angry conservative protesters."
Please. The same has been directed at Republicans in the past. There are
""Neither party has an exclusive on whack jobs," Republican media consultant Mark McKinnon told Politico. "Unfortunately, right now the Democrats generally get defined by President Obama, and Republicans, who have no clear leadership, get defined by crackpots -- and then they begin to define the Republican Party in the mind of the general public.""
Yes. Especially when the media tries its best to create that impression.
"The party's message-makers, already frustrated by lawmakers giving credence to the hysteria of fringe constituents, saw the antics of some GOP congressmen at Wednesday night's speech as the ultimate confirmation of their fears."
That was one individual, you liar.
"Even worse, it had racist undertones, a veteran Republican official said: "The image of a bunch of white guys booing an African-American president is about as bad as it gets.""
This is the risk we took when electing a black President. Not Obama's fault but some in the Democratic Party have no shame or concern for their country and will start to play the race card whenever Obama is criticized. We need a color-blind society and Democrats try to inflame racial tension for political game.
It's going to backfire on them.
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